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Post by LoCatus of Borg on Feb 19, 2008 21:42:32 GMT -5
I have been thinking about how things have gone this campaign. Overall it has been great and I think Shalafi has done a very good job especially since he inherited this position. So to him hats off <S>. I remember in the beginning we discussed how rules were rules and if "A" happened then "B" was the result. For example if people did not show up for a scheduled battle in a given time that an AI would fly in there place etc.. That is a very general overview but you get the idea. I would say that the rules as they are are reasonable. As I recall there is a 20 minute grace period in case you are running a little late etc....I think things would go better if we strictly enforced these rules in the next campaign with no exceptions. I realize that there are many new players who do not show up when they are supposed to and that is why the bent rules have been almost completely discarded. Maybe the people who do not do what they are supposed to should not be allowed to fly in the next campaign.... then following the rules would not be such a burden. I do not mean this in a negative manner toward anyone but I just want the experience of participating in a campaign to be improved. Once peeps agree to a time for a particular battle everything past that should be automatic with no decisions to be made. The players either show up or get replaced per rules. It would make the refs job much easier and might get people to show up if they know it will hurt their team if they do not. These are just my thoughts on the matter for future campaigns, not the current one. What do the rest of you think? ?
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Post by DeathFrog on Feb 19, 2008 22:15:18 GMT -5
I already agree, with minor exceptions, such as, the pilot is there, but has a technical difficulty, and we are working on it. IF the pilot is just simply not there, then we should be actually using the rules, but then again I am known as a Hardass for rules.
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Post by Head Fur Shalafi on Feb 20, 2008 0:27:03 GMT -5
true... thing is when HALF the people (both sides have been doing this) scheduled don't show up till 15min after the supposed start time the battles aren't going to get started remotely on time.
And every time it has come up both sides have said they would rather wait a little longer than force the AI into flying.
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Post by Evil Spock on Feb 20, 2008 8:38:45 GMT -5
Yes true Shalafi, but maybe the ideal is after they show up 15 minutes late and learn they have gotten the boot they will not do that again. Least that is the hope.
As it stands now folks show up late, no problem, everyone is sitting around with their thumbs up their butt. So no negative reforcement about being late, keep doing it.
I really feel that at least for now the final call should still should be left up to the Fleet Commanders,... it is their battle after all.
I do encourage everyone (as I will do and have stated) to stop allowing these unreasonable delays to occur, by starting battles on time, folks will show up on time. It may take a while but this will happen.
I am prepared mentally to rely on AI even for my team, in order to have the game launch at the 20 minute window. Others should prepare to do the same.
S
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Commander Malex
Backyard Yowler
SAY HELLO TO MY LITTLE FRIEND! "Kat-Of-Endless-Droning"
Posts: 881
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Post by Commander Malex on Feb 20, 2008 15:36:19 GMT -5
Agreed, and I especially want to Honor the wise and very fair decision of the Ref top restart the last battle which glitched out when two players crashed. The call was quite the correct and honorable thing to do!
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Post by LoCatus of Borg on Feb 21, 2008 20:38:23 GMT -5
I already agree, with minor exceptions, such as, the pilot is there, but has a technical difficulty, and we are working on it. IF the pilot is just simply not there, then we should be actually using the rules, but then again I am known as a Hardass for rules. Agreed, Josh was there within the 20 minute time limit. Unless I am remembering incorrectly per rules you just have to be there within the 20 minute time frame. So everything was good there. Technial difficulties will happen once in a while and we always work through them if possible .... all with in the rules.
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Post by LoCatus of Borg on Feb 21, 2008 20:41:54 GMT -5
Agreed, and I especially want to Honor the wise and very fair decision of the Ref top restart the last battle which glitched out when two players crashed. The call was quite the correct and honorable thing to do! From my perspective only Mav dropped.
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Post by Maximus Plasma on Feb 21, 2008 21:11:46 GMT -5
Well it is all well and fine to set guide lines rules etc... I agree that there should be a deadline for players to show up. that being said i will also point out that in every case so far that i have seen , When the players were late both sides agreed to wait . When both sides agree to wait why is there all this whining ? The rules say , blah blah blah, If you don't want to wait say so!! Don't cry about it latter! I know i will catch it for saying this but hey people this a game! A GAME!! we are here to have fun playing a game. So what if it goes off a little late. In my world i have to work , and making the battles "on time" are problematic, sometimes i can sometimes i can't. I try to make them, but if my world "real life " gets in the way of making it "on Time" then i show up when i can. if the game started without me . Oh well , guess what? Thats right i just try to make the next battle. I am aware that it is frustrating to set aside time in ones schedule to play then have to wait for someone who is late. But like i said above if you really want to play tell the ref that ! Walter has done a stand up job of reffing this campaign . I am sure he would enforce our rules if told to. By a Fleet admiral. OK go ahead start ripping me apart i have said my peace.
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Post by Evil Spock on Feb 22, 2008 8:56:25 GMT -5
I think we are all/most in agreement on this. We all tried to be accomodating initially hoping late folks could show up etc, especially to brand new players. I think over time we/many have come to a realization that waiting may not be the best precident to set. It may actually encourage more being late. No one has a problem if someone cannot make a battle. Barry you have always been good about letting us know one way or the other. The worst is someone who says, "ya I will be there in a few" and an hour later we are still waiting. Games will crash, we even have rules on that
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Post by Maximus Plasma on Feb 22, 2008 10:37:24 GMT -5
As we usally have enough players present , perhaps a rule revision is in order that would allow members of a team to replace anyone who is late, i know this could lead to abuse, but if we are here to play then lets play! The more you play the better you get "well except for me!" , And if you miss your scheduled turn too bad.
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Post by DeathFrog on Feb 22, 2008 11:32:32 GMT -5
I like that idea, with an exception that if a team really feels that battle needs be won, or, need to do damage to the oposing ships, they could ask that lesser skilled pilots be a no-show, or schedule battles when the lesser skilled pilots are unavailable, etc.. This abuse actually would be more on my team (this campaign only) only due to our having an average skill level below the Lyran pilots, and I would never use this, but it does not mean that next campaigns will be like that as most likely I wont be leading a side(unless requested).
Of course, this would also depend on the next campaigns being 2 sided, multisided, or otherwise. In a multi-side, or otherwise, most likely we could allow anyone to fly provided they show, as teams would be smaller. In a 2 sided, with many pilots participating, you need to have something in place to help control the use of specialized pilots.
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Post by Maximus Plasma on Feb 22, 2008 17:23:33 GMT -5
Well yes your point is always a possibilty. However sometimes trust is the decideing factor. we must trust that we are playing this game with honor, For fun. So like the damage rules requiring trust in the removal of spare parts from damaged ships. We may learn to trust that a team or memebers of our group . trust to the intent of playing a rotation of piliots. there is always a ref in our games and since all results are public with S.A. It would be difficult to abuse the system. "IMHO".
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Post by LoCatus of Borg on Feb 24, 2008 1:00:54 GMT -5
Never trust anyone with fleas......
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Post by Flea bag on Feb 25, 2008 9:32:51 GMT -5
Itch itch scratch argh, dang it! i hatezz zees fleas! but i trust our group will sitll buy me a new flea collar!
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Post by LoCatus of Borg on Feb 25, 2008 21:14:33 GMT -5
Well it is all well and fine to set guide lines rules etc... I agree that there should be a deadline for players to show up. that being said i will also point out that in every case so far that i have seen , When the players were late both sides agreed to wait . When both sides agree to wait why is there all this whining ? The rules say , blah blah blah, If you don't want to wait say so!! Don't cry about it latter! I know i will catch it for saying this but hey people this a game! A GAME!! we are here to have fun playing a game. So what if it goes off a little late. In my world i have to work , and making the battles "on time" are problematic, sometimes i can sometimes i can't. I try to make them, but if my world "real life " gets in the way of making it "on Time" then i show up when i can. if the game started without me . Oh well , guess what? Thats right i just try to make the next battle. I am aware that it is frustrating to set aside time in ones schedule to play then have to wait for someone who is late. But like i said above if you really want to play tell the ref that ! Walter has done a stand up job of reffing this campaign . I am sure he would enforce our rules if told to. By a Fleet admiral. OK go ahead start ripping me apart i have said my peace. (Please excuse the delayed reply but I missed this post earlier)...... Whining? Whining?? I do not think expecting players to show up within 20 minutes of a scheduled time is whining. If we had hard and fast rules governing this there would never have to be any agreement to wait longer...and longer... I know sometimes people with the best of intentions will miss battles or be an hour or more late...all I am saying is that we should replace them per rules after the 20 minute deadline. I will admit to having agreed to wait as to not look like an ass.....adherance to rules would solve this problem. Due to your suggestion MP I will insist that the rules be followed and be very vocal about it in any match of which I am a part. Oh by the way what I posted originaly did not apply to this campaign but the next one. Good rules followed corretly will make the next campaign experience funner for novice and expert alike which will increase our player base with the kind of players we are looking for......... I think this deserves serious consideration for the next campaign.
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